[jdubsram-13Participant]

I haven’t seen this yet

1. Dwight Howard-Magic
2. Al Jefferson-Bobcats
3. Devin Harris-Bulls
4. Jameer Nelson-Clippers
5. Andre Iguodala-Wizards
6. Emeka Okafor-Hawks
7. Ben Gordon-Suns
8. Luol Deng-Raptors
9. Josh Smith-76ers
10. J.R. Smith-Cavaliers
11. Andris Biedrins-Warriors
12. Shaun Livingston-Sonics(Thunder)
13. Kevin Martin-Blazer
14. Delonte West-Jazz
15. Josh Childress-Celtics
16. Chris Duhon-Jazz
17. Anderson Varejao-Hawks
18. Trevor Ariza-Hornets
19. Beno Udrih-Heat
20. Sasha Vujacic-Nuggets

My top 20 of the 2004 Draft, once again not on team needs

[Al-Farouq AminuParticipant]

Okay, I don’t want to sound mean, but this is a bad draft analysis.

Kevin Martin is 15th. He socres like 24 pts a game and was almost voted as All-Star last year.
Biedrins is 3X better than Livingston (often injuried), and he is only 1 step higher ?
Okafor has better career averages than all Jefferson, Harris, and Nelson.
Josh Smith sould be top 5, and Iggy should be #2

[Tha King2121Participant]

Just 1 question do u watch Basketball?
Just about the only right thing is Superman # 1

[sheltwon3Participant]

1.Dwight Howard(Superstar ofensive and defensively)

2. Al Jefferson(can’t be guarded in the low post)

3. Andre Iguadala( a athletic freak of nature with all around skills)

4. Devin Harris(Ultra quick point with great size and nice perimeter skills)

5. Josh Smith(Athletic young player who is still learning that game and yet still causing Havoc on both sides of the floor)

6. Emeka Okafor(Defensive player with decent offensive skills)

7.Luol Deng(he has been injured but when healthy excellent mid range game witn nice athleticism)

8.JR Smith(When he is hot he is almost Jordan like offensively)

9. Kevin Martin(Offensive player in the mold of Reggie Miller; been injured lately though)

10.Ben Gordon( undersized offensive minded player who is very clutch)

11.Andris Biedrins(solid big man who can run the floor and D it up still learning offensively)

12.Jameer Nelson(shoot first point guard that has surpassed expectation with his rising play)

13.Shaun Livingston(He would be much higher if not for knee injury that almost ended his carreer; he will be back though to full strength soon and you will see)

14.Anderson Varejao(versatile big who is a monster on the defensive end and has solid offensive skills)

15.Trevor Ariza( an athletic swingman who has open up his perimeter to game to go with he highlight dunks and nice defensive skills; he is young so he could move up this list soon)

16. Josh Childress(all around player who is current overseas getting paid)

17. Robert Swift(young big who has had a ton of injuries but hopefully when healthy he can show us his great skills for someone his size)

18. Delonte West( Solid Combo guard who can play both positions well)

19. Tony Allen(athletic defensive ace playing behind Hall of famers)

20.Chris Duhon(great playmaking skills but is not great offensive and struggles some of the defensive end with bigger players)

21. Sasha Vujacic(the machine he play good D and has a nice perimeter game but is streaky)

22.Sebastian Telfair( young quick and has no j and too small to guard most NBA points)

23.Beno Udrih(nice back up playing starter for worst team in league)

24.Dorell Wright(young and still promising; injuries have slowed his development)

25. Kirk Snyder( great defensive and solid offensive player that is not in league mostly due to his attitude and just didnt fit into some teams plan)

[WhyParticipant]

1.Dwight Howard(Superstar ofensive and defensively)- Agree

2. Al Jefferson(can’t be guarded in the low post)- Agree

3. Andre Iguadala( a athletic freak of nature with all around skills)/ DEVIN HARRIS- I would switch this with Devin Harris, I love Iggy but PG is a more valuable position to put it simply. For Harris to average 22 and 7 is incredibly only other people who did that were LeBron, Dwade and CP3

4. Devin Harris(Ultra quick point with great size and nice perimeter skills)- IGGY- I would put Iggy here, he’s amazing and after last nights game winning, buzzer beating playoff win against the number 3 seed magic he is showing he has alot of skills.

5. Josh Smith(Athletic young player who is still learning that game and yet still causing Havoc on both sides of the floor)- I Agree with this and I could see him maybe being drafted ahead of Iggy, this man is a defensive game changer and if he had a coach with balls he wouldn’t be so immature

I would change the order of 6-12 like this:

6. Emeka Okafor- Solid defensive presence with size for a center so he has high value
7. Kevin Martin- Probably better than Okafor but since he only scores he’s not as valuable.
8. Jameer Nelson- Not as good as some of the players behind him but he is a PG and they are valued higher. Just like big men.
9. Ben Gordon- Streaky Shooter who can shoot you in and out of games. Good 6th man. Not as clutch as advertised
10. Andris Biedrins- Solid big who can play D and crash the boards
11. Luol Deng- Good, injury prone but has talent on offense and defense for a swing man
12. Shaun Livingston- Has skills the Clippers killed this kids career. Sad.
13. JR Smith- Definitely NOT EVER Jordan-esque sad to compare him Jordan deserves better. Not a bad 7th or eight guy off the bench to ignite your scoring though.

[wowthisisneatParticipant]

1.Dwight-Dominant physical center. No arguments.
2.Jefferson-Extremely polished young center/pf out of HS great building block.
3.Harris-can be a pure point(Dallas), or the scoring/set-up man (NJ). Blazing speed and defense.
4.Emeka-Double-double 2block per game centers are tough to find. A reliable center to plug in.
5.Kevin Martin-Lights out shooter and scorer. Can be the primary option on any offense.
6.Iguodala-Multi-skilled wingman can be great fit on any team, just not the number 1.
7.Biedrins-Similar to Emeka statistically but plays in stat friendly GS. Still, an improving young big.
8.Gordon-Great shooter, like Martin just 4 inches shorter. Causes defensive liability. A great scorer off the bench or starting.
9.Josh Smith-Potential still great. While he hasn’t harnessed some of it, defensive stud provides nice O as well.
10.Nelson-Good shooting point guard who can now really run an offense. Having number 1 on this list on your team sure helps too though.
11.Deng-Long athletic small forward can do a number of things on either side of the ball.
12.JR Smith-Great athlete and 3pt shooter. Inconsistent midrange game limits production but bench star can erupt and take over games.
13.Childress-Great energy player off the bench that does all of the little things well.
14.Varejao-A bit of a flopper on defense yet he can still hold his own there. Great hair for the fans.
15.Ariza-Very long with a high ceiling. A developing 3pt game gives him a scary skill set. Lock-down defender.
16.Duhon-NYK numbers boost him but it was a successful first year as a starter. Can run the pick-roll.
17.West-Great defensive player and solid on offense. He wont hurt you on either side of the ball.
18.Livingston-Incredibly sized pg. Good playmaker and 2nd pg. Has chance to become a starter.
19.Vujacic-At this point he is a defensive and 3pt specialist. Even at that hes a little streaky at times.
20.Telfair-Good backup pg who can create his own shot. Read into his own hype too much.

[matrix061086Participant]

The original list on here is ridiculous. I agree with kxkx08, how is Martin 15th? Also, how is Ben Gordon 7th?

K-Mart is much better than Ben Gordon. Martin averages like 20-plus per game, while Gordon isn’t anything more than a good 6th man. Both K-Mart and Josh Smith should be ranked higher than Gordon and Okafor. Also, I’m not sure that Nelson is a better player than Martin, Smith, or Iguodala. He’s good, but not that good.

[RooeyRacerParticipant]

1. Dwight Howard
2. Al Jefferson
3. Andre Iguodala
4. Devin Harris
5. Emeka Okafor
6. Josh Smith
7. Ben Gordon
8. Kevin Martin
9. Luol Deng
10. Jameer Nelson
11. Andris Biendrins
12. J.R. Smith
13. Shaun Livingston
14. Josh Childress
15. Delonte West
16. Chris Duhon
17. Anderson Varejao
18. Trevor Ariza
19. Sasha Vujacic
20. Beno Udrih

[blackflash234Participant]

1.Dwight Howard
2.Al Jefferson
3.Andre Iguadala
4.Devin Harris
5.Kevin Martin
6.Josh Smith
7.Ben Gordon
8.Luol Deng
9.Emeka Okafor
10.Jameer Nelson
11.J.R. Smith
12.Andris Biedrins
13.Josh Childress
14.Trevor Ariza
15.Chrus Duhon
16.Delonte West
17.Anderson Varajao
18.Beno Udrih
19.Sasha Vujacic
20. Sebastian Telfair

[Mr. BasketballParticipant]

1. D-12
2. Al Jefferson
3. Shaun Livingston – had he not been on the clippers (clippers’ bad luck), he would have been good.
4. Harris
5. Iguodala
6. Martin
7. Josh smith
8. Jameer Nelson
9. Okafor
10. Gordon
11. Biedrins
12. Deng
13. Ariza
14. Smith
15. Childress

[heelsfan1307Participant]

you are all idiots. the first guy was right on with his list.
Dwight Howard obviously, Big Al, beast 20 and 10 , Devin Harris premier PG, along with Jameer an all star. Iguodala is getting there. still needs to be consistent with his jumper. Emeka rebounds, Ben gordon is a flat out stud. i would have luol deng lower however. and move up jr and andris. as for kevin martin? COME ON Guys. he averages 24 on the worst team in the league. GET REAL. you put Ben Gordon on that team and he averages 30 easily.

[matrix061086Participant]

Heelsfan1307, you are out of your mind. Ben Gordon is a good scorer, but he is not going to average 30 on any team in the NBA. I don’t know why people think Gordon is so good. Even back in 2004 I thought the Bulls wasted the 3rd pick on him. Gordon is nothing more than a streak shooter and a great sixth man.

Martin, on the otherhand, is one of the most efficient scorers in the league. He’s 6’7″ as compared to Gordon’s probable 6’1″ height. Plus, Martin is more athletic than Gordon, can drive better than Gordon, a better defender than Gordon, and almost as good of a shooter as Gordon. For Gordon to score 30 it would probably take him like 20 shots, but for K-Mart it only takes like 10 or 11. I guarantee right now that the Bulls would swap Gordon for Martin in a heartbeat. If Gordon is so good then why is it that nobody in the league wanted him last year during free agency. I know he was restricted but he couldn’t even round up any decent deals. That’s because he’s nothing more than a great bench player who is a defensive liability.

[KATASTROPHEParticipant]

Damn heelsfan how are you talking shit and YOU think Ben Gordon can average 30 on any team… No way Ben Gordon can average 30 for any team he is too streaky and he is not dynamic enough plus not many guys his size score like that Yeah he can score in bunches but 30 a game. ARE YOU SERIOUS???? Actually Kevin Martin when healthy is one of the most efficent scores in the league.

[Masrock]

He is a good scorer from the looks of it. The TC has it wrong, from that standing. I would put Iggy over Nelson, and Harris over Iggy.

[henryoh90612Participant]

martin should be higher and deng should be a little lower

[BasketBalAllanParticipant]

1. Dwight Howard – Magic
2. Al Jefferson – Bobcats
3. Devin Harris – Bulls
4. Andre Iguodala – Clippers
5. Kevin Martin – Wizards
6. Josh Smith – Hawks
7. Jameer Nelson – Suns
8. Ben Gordon – Raptors
9. Emeka Okafor – 76ers
10. Luol Deng – Cavaliers
11. Andris Biedrins – Warriors
12. J.R. Smith – Sonics (Thunder)
13. Chris Duhon – Blazer
14. Anderson Varejao – Jazz
15. Beno Udrih – Celtics
16. Delonte West – Jazz
17. Shaun Livingston – Hawks
18. Trevor Ariza – Hornets
19. Josh Childress – Heat
20. Sasha Vujacic – Nuggets

[sheltwon3Participant]

Lol this is fun but I would like for people who disagree with my list to maybe comments on why they thought someone was better. This is boring if we just put up out most liked players without defending our arguments. I put Josh Smith above Okafor because number one he can play more position, has more upside and if I compare them both at the forward position since Okafor is not really a true C, Smith is ahead. If you don’t believe me check the stats and I have seen Okafor play, he doesn’t impress much. He is a solid player but is not that explosive) Also JR Smith’s problem early on was his maturity. He is starting to get it and he is more athletic than Kevin Martin and also when he is feeling which is starting to be more and more he can put up huge number and can’t be guarded. My Deng pick was a little hard mainly because lately he has been injured but prior to injuries he was very solid and all around with a perfect mid range game. Also he is heady and consistent and that is what i felt gave him the age but that pick is debatable. Iguadala is clutch and has all around skills. He came in giving top scorers fits on defense and his offense is coming around. His present and future are too bright not to put up here. Also people you need to understand a good big man is worth more than wing players and can only be bested by a great point guard. Also Livingston would have been a lot higher had he not gottern hurt.

[matrix061086Participant]

I would debate you on the J.R. Smith is better than Kevin Martin statement. J.R. Smith certainly is talented, and is working to get past his maturity problems, but the simple fact is he plays with Carmelo, Nene, and Chauncey Billups. All of those players are better than him and more important scoring options for the Nuggets. That means Smith will get a lot of spot-ups and one-on-one coverage from defenders who probably aren’t the best on their teams. So obviously of course he’s going to get hot and not be defended. Martin on the other hand averages 20ppg with nobody on his team and does it as one of the more efficient scorers in the league. Plus, he does not have an attitude problem and he’s more athletic than you think. I’m pretty sure Martin had the highest one-step vertical during the 2004 draft at least this site reported that. So I wouldn’t say Smith is all that more athletic than him. If you put Martin on the Nuggets then Dahntay Jones doesn’t start as he currently does.

However, I think you are definitely correct about Okafor. Smith to me is a much better player. He is more athletic, better on offense, and much more versatile. Okafor doesn’t seem athletic at all. Plus, Smith helped lead the Hawks to the playoffs as one of their main players. So far Okafor, as the 2nd pick overall, hasn’t even come close to leading the Bobcats into the playoffs.

Deng is definitely a hard person to rate. Before the injuries he was one of the brightest young players in the league. Hopefully he can recover and get back to that level.

[sheltwon3Participant]

I just want to find some like minded people that can help me see some things I may not have but in order to do that you have to explain your choices and if we run into a situation where we just don’t agree hey if life some things are just debatable because there are no clear cut right answers.

[sheltwon3Participant]

Why ,I apreciate your comments and your analysis. I will have to say to you and also the other guy who disagrees with me when will just have to agree to disagree on JR Smith. Also Jameer Nelson should not be that high. Rafer Alston is actually playing the point better than Jameer who is shoot first but he has better playmaking skills than Gordon who is would be a pretty good scoring point too if they allowed him to be that. Also Gordon is about 6’2″ I would put Deng so low. I know point guards get the highest value but honestly because Jameer is not a playmaking point and is not a ultra scorer, I don’t value him all that much because Orlando is just a good place for him to put up numbers and because they have a inside outside system, his play making skills looked better than they are. He is still a little above average to me. Kevin Martin could go higher but I just know how good Deng use to be and he is was just so solid and he is a lot more versatile than Martin is. Also everyone in the NBA is athletic. Athleticism is not all about jumping higher. I did not say that Martin was not athletic. I just feel honestly from watching Smith that he is more athletic than Martin. Also if not for Smith’s attitude that has been changing in a positive note the only not on him is his defense that is slightly below average right now. Also offensive when he gets hot he is like Jordan. Unlike most people I have seen Jordan early years and I like him as a player not this ultra hype sensation people see him as. I see his flaws and his greatness. My Assessment I feel is very accurate. Compare Smith’s great games to Jordan’s and you will see what I am talking bout. George Karl does not like him and neither did Scott because he does do immature things and some of the coaches hold grudges. Talent wise is deserves that spot because he is like 3 or 4 years younger than Martin so also if you are drafting you have to look at that. Kevin Martin puts up number on an average to terrible Kings team.

[matrix061086Participant]

Sheltwon, I think you nailed it when you said we will have to agree to disagree.

[jdubsram-13Participant]

The only reason he scores 20+ ppg is because he is on a terrible Kings team, and is the only one with a decent shot!

[WhyParticipant]

While the arguement “he only scores that much cause he’s not a bad team” holds some water, you do realize that means he’s usually being double teamed, and all the defensive focus is on him? K-Mart is not a go to guy but as a second or third option he is perfect. Great ranger and as Matrix said, he’s EFFICIENT. He doesn’t jack up 20-25 shots to score 25-30 points. He’s efficient, great 3 point and mid range game along with great FT%.

[sheltwon3Participant]

I never said that he was not skilled. We are comparing two player that are both good. I am not going to downplay Kevin Martin but I am just saying JR Smith could put up the same numbers on Sacramento and he is 4 years younger and from watching both of them play I feel Smith is more explosive athletically. I love Kevin Martin as a player and had him pretty high up. He is a Reggie Miller type player but he has been injured so it is hard to know if he can carry a team. My thing is do you disagree with that Smith could put up the same kind of numbers on a Sacramento things and if he has consistent minutes. Do you also disagree that Smith looks more explosive than Martin. We are not arguing this is good discussion. I am not even arguing that Martin is better than Smith other that to say that when I made my list I actually took the time and evaluated things like a GM. I actually want to be an NBA GM but it right now I am going to school for video game development.

[KATASTROPHEParticipant]

I dont think JR Simth has the mentality being a 1st option (like Martin). In the NBA it is way diffrent from starting and being a 1st or 2nd option and coming off the bench and being a 3rd or 4th option. There is a reson WHY he doesnt get big minutes he is like a modern day Microwave Johnson (with more range) “Also offensive when he gets hot he is like Jordan” doesnt make sense becasue when JR Simth scores 30 or more he is hitting 5 or 6 three’s and Jordan gets his 30 or more its usually from from the midrange and in the paint…. Watching the Bulls Celtics game Gordon looks shorter than Rondo.

[WhyParticipant]

JR Smith comparisons are really, really, unwarranted. Like KATASTROPHE said, MJ didn’t start stroking it from 3 point range until he was later in his career. If JR Smith ever goes off for 30+ points it’s because he hit 5 or 6 threes. JR Smith is like alot of those late lottery picks straight from HS, lots of raw talent (the whole reason he got drafted) but no mental toughness or basketball smarts. Smith seems to be getting it together, but he’s been in the league for 5 years now…don’t you think you’re putting too much stock in his explosiveness? We’ve seen Kevin Martin drop 25 ppg for 2 straight years…how can you not think he deserves to be taken ahead of JR Smith who has shown nothing of the sort of an 82 game season?

JR Smith has and always will be a spark-plug off the bench. Besides his ridiculous athleticism and more height, he is a poor mans Ben Gordon, he’ll shoot you in and out of games, stroke the three, get some steals but not much else. Seriously, MJ came into the league and averaged 28 points per game his rookie season, its legitimately a slap in the face to put JR Smith anywhere near MJ at any point in time.

[KATASTROPHEParticipant]

Well said…

[sheltwon3Participant]

Number one you are looking at some of his points and yes He is a way better 3 point shooter than Jordan but if you actually watch him play he has a variety of ways to get to the basket and finish like Jordan. Look obviously I have said something that cause people to overanalyze what I said the main point i was making is he is unguardable when he get hot and he does drive to the basket with athletic flair. If you disagree with me I can understand that but even when I disagree with someone based of gut feeling facts I don’t speak as if they have no clue what they are saying. You have an opinion and in all honestness I am still trying to figure out how you base this because I have actually watch games with Smith and I have watch old school MJ as well as new school MJ and I know that he does not play exactly like MJ. The whole thing was that he is impossible to guard when he is hot. I guess I will be more careful in what I said because it could lead to misintepretations. They do share some similiar skills in getting to the basket but Smith is more of a deep range assassin. With argument you are saying even Kobe who is compared as close to Jordan does not have game like Jordan. The person who most has game like Jordan in his early years to prime is actually Dwayne Wade. Kobe does has his midrange game but so do a lot of NBA players.

[sheltwon3Participant]

I do hope that next team Smith goes to that he shows what I am saying because right now he is not the first option mainly because of defense, immature mistakes and, the coach is not fond of him. Yall gush about OJ Mayo and I love OJ Mayo skill set and he plays D but offensively JR Smith would eat him up. I really don’t understand how yall are seeing something I definitely not seeing. Smith is not even my top pick, I put him down below and I am not all in love with him but I am kind of frustrated that noone disagrees with me and throw facts out, they point out little things and try to blow it up like well like that 3 point thing like I am not aware of Jordan and Smith’s tendancies. Smith has been putting up big number enough like that he is on scouting reports. Teams are aware of him. Trust that. Smith does not alway get the opportunity to get hot because being a second and third option is not alway about skill and that is why you have some player when they get traded put up numbers and you are like how come they could not do that in so and so place because they were not getting touches or minutes.

[WhyParticipant]

I have made many good points of why his game are flawed. You just simply seem to have a man-crush on him. I don’t know what to tell you, I am pretty positive he will never be a star, let alone super-star.

[heelsfan1307Participant]

Hmmm…. 42 points in the playoffs against the defending champs…. I hope Kevin Martin has a really nice TV so he could see that performance.

[matrix061086Participant]

Yeah Gordon definitely went off last night, but I’d still go with Martin. He scored 50 points on 11 shots earlier in the year. That’s good enough for me.

[KATASTROPHEParticipant]

Im not a Gordon fan but dude was outta control today… (he seemed impossible to stop) JR Smith can put em up in a hurry though but his handle is shaky… He shoots alot of threes (and makes alot) but what about his mid range game, I think he would need one to score like Martin as a number one option (but the question about Martin is can he stay healthy?)

[G-BAYParticipant]

No way he shoulda slipped as far as he did back then… hes been nothin but solid. as far as Martin/Gordon. Martin does more and with greater efficiency

[WhyParticipant]

Ben Gordon can play incredibly filthy. If the dude had 4-6 more inches he’d be dropping 25-30 no doubt. Too bad you can’t learn height. I don’t know how he does it, getting his shot off while being double teamed by guys at least 2 inches taller than him. Filthy shot. GO BULLS

[sheltwon3Participant]

Why– do you watch basketball, how old are you? I am not trying to be insulting after that man-crush thing but I realize I may be talking to someone that does not watch a lot of basketball and also may be to young to remember the league before now. I will agree that Smith mid range game needs work. He is and interest fact about Jordan when he came into the league, he was not a great shooter and his mid range game needed work. I have watch enough highlights and old school games to see the similarities. You seem to also forget that the year that Denver trade for Iverson, Carmelo and JR Smith were leading the league in best scoring duo and JR Smith was a number 2 option. Some of yall just look at stat line instead of watch games. Also Ben Gordon’s height is what makes him below Kevin Martin who can score at about that same clip. The both or a handfull when they get it going. Also Martin is at home because his team is not that good and they play in the West. Chicago would be at home too is they played in the West. I do hope people do not mistake this for a Gordon bashing or a Martin love fest. These are just the facts. Martin has a nice deal coming his way and Gordon doesn’t but I will say he may have improve his value with last night and the year he had. I still don’t know where he will go though maybe Toronto.

[WhyParticipant]

I’m 20 Sheltwon how old are you? I hope no older than me because, no offense, you have pretty poor grammar. Try breaking up your paragraph into more than one.

What do you mean Martin is at home? I don’t get what you mean by that. He’s more comfortable in the Western Conference? I’m confused.

I watch as much basketball as I possibly can. Meaning every televised game which sadly isn’t much too much. It’s hard being from Saint Louis and being a basketball fan…We have nothing.

With this whole JR Smith thing. i don’t know where you’re going with this. JR Smith has all the PHYSICAL tools to become an all star. We agree on this. The fact is, do you truly believe he is going to become a perennial all star? Saying he’s like Jordan is saying ALOT. There were other athletes back in the day who you could better compare him to in my opinion. Also, you say Jordan didn’t have a midrange game when he came into the league. Which, true or not, doesn’t help your opinion about him being like JR Smith. JR Smith either shoots threes, or does a crazy dunk layup. Very one dimensional game. JR Smith also has nowhere near the drive or determination that Jordan does. Actually, no one ever did.

[WhyParticipant]

Also about Jameer Nelson. I’m not a fan of him much at all…but this year he really really started stroking the three and passing better. He’s above average and an above average point guard in the league is huge. Very important position. With my 2004 draft redo mock thing above us, I put Nelson above some others because the point guard is a premium position. Also, I don’t see Alston as an 82 game starting point guard. Nelson won’t take over games, but he knows his place.

[tli232]

Wow. Dude. Jdub-whatever. How can you rank Gordon 8 spots over Martin? Also, how you in the world do you rank Nelson over Iggy, J-smoove, Okafor, K- martin and half the rest of the list? My biggest beef is regarding this Nelson ranking though. Nelson is an above-average Point Guard at best. Iggy is a borderline Superstar, K-Mart is a star, Okafor has potential defensive player of the year and/or 1st/2nd team all defense written all over him.

Jdub….. seriously? I’m hoping that either you had a temporary tumor in your Parietal Lobe (the part that controls movement and coordination) or a tumor in your frontal lobe (the part that controls reasoning)

[sheltwon3Participant]

Wow that is harsh but I do understand your feeling though because five of the point guards is this said to be weak draft could easily replace Nelson. I have seen this guy play and honestly he is a lil above average because he works hard and can shoot and his has little experience with playmaking but he is not that good just works for that team and now it will be interesting to see what happens next year when they have Alston and Nelson because if Alston improves his shooting a little bit, it would be stupid to start Nelson over him.

[derekmorris21Participant]

i think he might “at home” as that because sacremento is in the west that they are at home and not in the playoffs… just like chicago would be at home if they played in the west, because the west is tougher

[Gabereal33Participant]

@ derekmorris21 “i think he might “at home” as that because sacremento is in the west that they are at home and not in the playoffs… just like chicago would be at home if they played in the west, because the west is tougher”

Aren’t the kings the worst team in the NBA? Do you even watch basketball? You should just shut up before you make yourself look worse. Does it bother you that the Bulls are better than the Kings? Let me put it into perspective:

Before the trade, the second best player on the Kings was Salmons…He is the Bulls 4th or 5th option. Your 3rd best player was Miller. He is probably the 6th or 7th best player on the Bulls. Kevin Martin (your best player) would even be the 3rd best player on the Bulls! Get a clue or shut up

[Gabereal33Participant]

You have to consider team needs.. cant be based only on potential or THIS season’s breakout players otherwise Devin Harris, Al Jefferson, and JR Smirth would be 2nd 3rd and 4th…

and how would you measure Shaun Livingston? he could have been the best player not named Dwight in this group..

2004 DRAFT REDO– based on potential and team needs measuring players’ CAREER accomplishments:

1)Orlando — Dwight Howard

2)Charlotte — Emeka Okafor (dont even get me started! Okafor is an amazing talent and has played terrificly his WHOLE career)

3)Chicago — Andre Igoudala (next michael jordan?? nah.. but damn good. can do almost everything really really really well)

4)Clippers — Devin Harris (a more reliable and accomplished point than Shaun Livingston)

5)Dallas — Josh Smith (Dirk, Nash, and Josh would have been amazing!)

6)Atlanta — Al Jefferson (securing Al with their first of two first round picks!)

7)Chicago — Ben Gordon (shame..he really should be higher on this list! Ben is a special talent…. chicago lucks out!)

8)Toronto — Kevin Martin (Vince’s long longed running mate and future face of the franchise?)

9)Philly — Loul Deng (not quite as great as Andre Igoudala but a pretty great teammate and competent small forward)

10)Cleveland —Shaun Livingston (Lebron and a healthy Livingston try their best to become the “pass-first” versions of Michael and Scotty)

11)GoldenState- Andris Biendrins (Drafted exactly where he should have been drafted. A shot blocker and nightly double double threat)

12)Seattle — Anderson Varajao (They desperately needed size in 2004 and he is an outstanding defender…terrificly unlikable guy!)

13)Portland — Jameer Nelson (they needed a pg. he’s a character guy– better fit for the “Jailblazers” than a JR Smith)

14)Utah — Josh Childress (long and athletic and can do most things really well. possible steal of the draft!.. JR Smith slides to…)

15)Boston — JR Smith (all star potential baller who would have learned a lot from Paul Pierce)

16)Utah — Chris Duhon (Utah gets some more help at the point)

17)Atlanta — Trevor Ariza (they need athleticism on the wings big time…)

18)New Orleans–Delonte West (solid defender and 3 point shooter who can backup Chris Paul or play alongside him)

19)Miami — Tony Allen (Good defender in the mold of Dwayne wade with half his athleticism.. maybe he can learn from Wade??)

20)Denver — Beno Udrih (an average backup pg/sg)

21)Dallas — Kirk Snyder (who knows.. maybe with Nash he could have been better?)

22)Portland — David Harrison (backup center)

23)Portland– Luke Jackson (hometown favorite.. might have played ok at home??)

24)Boston– Kris Humphries (whitey boys always get love in Beantown…)

the rest is really a stretch….

[KATASTROPHEParticipant]

Are you serious MARTIN would kill on the Bulls.. Rose 6’3, MARTIN 6’7, Salmons 6’7, Thomas 6’9, Noah 6’11, who is the SECOND best player in that lineup?? That would all of a sudden be a long lineup, if KMart played on the Bulls he would give you Ben Gordons 20 and shoot better from the field and three point line… Plus Martin has the size to match up better with other teams SG’s… Gordon should have used some of that 40 point energy to stop Jesus… The problem with Martin is he is always injured.

[jdubsram-13Participant]

Thanks for the support, I skimmed over the others the last time but re-reading it you pretty much nailed why I had most of them the way I did

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