Find it very difficult to believe Charlotte parts ways with MKG so soon but if they did...
If you were in the Bobcats position what would you demand for MKG and #4???
Whats the "?????" part of it?
Obviously the Bobcats wouldn't give up MKG and the #4 pick for just the #1 alone. So it would have to be the #1 and something else (hence the ?????) and the follow up question, If you were in the Bobcats position what would you demand.
This makes sense, Cleveland wants Len, but they know its a stretch at #1, so they move back to 4. But I'm curious who Charlotte would want here. And I'm not sure if it would really help Cleveland in the long run because of who they'd have to give up.
Great move for the Cavs...I love MKG it will take a couple more years for him to develop but he's gonna be real good.
But if the cavs really want Len, they can't trade down with the bobcats cuz they'll take him first overall.
If I was the Bobcats the only way I would trade MKG was for the 1st pick straight up and keep my #4 pick.
Who knows what the rumor really means or if its about Charlotte at all. MKG does seem like the only viable small forward around outside of the Magic wing combo of Harkless and Harris. The Wiz-Kings-Hornets definitely don't have one and viable hasn't suited Mike Beasley so far in his NBA career. That's picks 2-7 and if Len is the desired target then thats as far as you can go back. Unless they are talking sign and trade Henderson if he qualifies as a small forward.
We know the Cavs love MKG and him and Kyrie Irving were HS teammates. When the Cavs tried to move up to the 2nd pick last year it was for MKG not Bradley Beal. Hopefully this is true, I got negged up for saying they should make a deal like this for MGK a month ago. Plus next years wing class is loaded and the HornCats are tanking big time anyway.
I really wonder what the "and something" to the deal is from the Cavs side? I would expect they ask for Thompson and hope for we give Zeller instead. A center coming to the HornCats would free them up to draft small and alleviate the question marks of restricted free agency they face with Mullens. Zeller could return back to North Carolina and give the Hornets the ability to take McLemore at one. If Thompson, who I don't believe they would give up because he is just as good a prospect as MKG at this point to me, is the player then Bennett could be the pick also. It was reported that the Cavs have scouted Bennett at least 8 times and they thought they would end up in the 4 the 9 range in the lottery before the season collapsed as extra awful. Remember they fired B Scott because he didn't live up to the expectation of at least showing some win/lose improvement. I think No. 1, Zeller, CJ Miles (at 2 million he is a bargain and the HornCats are desperate for shooting) and maybe even the rights to Wanye Ellington (UNC). I want to keep the 19th pick in case the Russian shooter falls there but it can go too.
I wonder if Alonzo Gee is in the potential deal because having him and MKG is redundant.
Kidd-Gilchrist for the 1st pick is more fair to me. Charlotte shouldnt have to give up #4
Cleveland would need to include Tristan Thompson and 19.
What if its
#1,#19,#31, Speights, Gee
#4, MKG, Thomas
If this trade ever happened, it would reunite MKG with HS teammate Kyrie Irving
Even though the Cavs really want MKG, I really can't see them giving up Tristan Thompson in any package for him. Tristan has improved immensely and was more of a vocal leader last year, not to mention a huge part of the Cavs "core" going forward.
My first question is, who do the Bobcats want here? Is it Noel? Or is it McLemore? Assuming it is Noel, their objective would clearly be to tank one more season and have a good shot in the Wiggins Sweepstakes next year.
Nonetheless, if this is actually pursued to a more serious extent (which I doubt).. I see the Cavs starting with the following:
Obviously Bobcats will turn that down, but Cavs have been known to lowball people. After it gets denied, I see Cavs throwing a couple of their assets in the ring such as the Kings 1st round pick, and maybe even the Memphis 1st round pick. All of this is hypothetical of course, but I really just don't see the Cavs throwing Tristan in any trade that isn't a border-line all star.
So, to rephrase..
2014 Sacramento 1st Round Pick (Top 12 protected)
2015 Memphis 1st round pick (top 1-5 and 15-30 protected)
Seems a little more appealing for both sides.
I would prefer to give a Cavs 2014 pick instead of both of those picks. The Sac pick may never exist anyway though and the Memphis pick may not pay out till 2019 so it does look really good Charlotte but may not cost the Cavs a lot in the future. I want to keep them because if the Cavs get good they will need young talent because Kyrie and company are approaching coming off that rookie deal when those picks play out and I don't want to be faced with the problem OKC had. Where your guys come off rookie deals and you didnt have a plethora of first rounders to draft role players with. Vets dont come to Cleveland for cheap so we will have to have a lot of mid first rounders to use to fill in role players.
give up Tristian and draft Bennett. Cats prob take Ben, they know they will suck next year and they could draft Wiggins, Jabari or Randle. So take a SG this year.
what you are saying is that the Cavs really want MKG, they just aren't willing to give up anything of value to obtain him?
That means they don't really want MKG.
Obviously for this to happen, either a ton more picks or Waiters would have to be involved.
So I expect the Cavs to do the same thing this year. I hope that the Cavs can avoid giving Thompson, because I like him and he incidentally has the same agent as Lebron James. I would give a completely unprotected 2014 pick. Cho has been selling that the Hornets could have 3 first rounders in next years loaded draft. They have the Blazers top 12 protected and the Pistons top 8 so both are obtainable but neither is guaranteed. A Cavaliers, who have had three straight seasons in the bottom five in win lose record, 2014 unprotected pick is a truly great asset. According to the Cavs they are going to challenge for a playoff spot so Tristan Thompson would only have to be worth a late lottery to mid teens pick for the Cavs to give up the pick instead. A next years swap is a possibility also. I say the Cavs bet on themselves to do better. That would put a lot of pressure on the whole organization to do well this year.
Charlotte: No. 1 pick, 2014 Cavs unprotected pick, Zeller and Miles and maybe 19
Cavs: MKG and 4 pick
With 2 automatic picks next year and a potential for 4 top 17 picks the Hornets would drastically rise in future power ranking and energize the franchise.
Maybe a unprotected pick is to much but I don't think so. They could offer to swap picks with Charlotte next year with Charlotte getting the better pick. So if the Cavs win the lottery next year Charlotte who would still have a top 6 pick can swap picks. This way the Hornets get a better chance at one of next years top wings.
I would take Ben Gordons contract if necessary and we didn't have to give up TT or the 19th pick.
I agree that our 2014 first round pick is a great asset. Trading the pick though is very risky and could get CG fired if it doesn't work out. I personally think we can get more than MKG with that pick and we wouldn't have to give up our first pick this year.
I'd do this trade instead with Orlando:
Magic gets: 2014 unprotected, #19 pick and Alonzo Gee
Cavs get: #2 pick and Tobias Harris
What if we agree to swap picks next year with Charlotte getting the better pick. Even if we get the first we wouldnt be picking less than 5, the Hornets will suck this year.
Sounds good to me! I really think we'll be in the hunt for the playoffs next season though.
Right now, that pick holds very little value. Cleveland is expected to be much better next year, and should be in the hunt for a playoff spot. So you are saying that a 15-20 pick is a great asset? I get that everyone is talking about how incredible next years draft is going to be. But your scenario is
Magic get: probable mid first round 2014 pick, #19 and Gee
Cavs get: #2 and Harris.
So how do they get the better picks and player in the deal?
MKG is the Bobcats most valuable player considering his potential,. Kemba is their best player, but MKG is suppose to be the guy to take them to the next level.
Makes zero sense to let him go so easily to a team in the Eastern Conference...Bobcats only do this for the #1 pick + Thompson.
I think your scenario looks great for Cleveland, but not so much for Charlotte. To get value, you have to give up value. Zeller and a couple of other teams future protected picks isn't going to get it done in my opinion. The only way I see them giving up a player like MKG is for another intriguing prospect in return. While Zeller is a nice player, I think we all can agree that both MKG and Tristan Thompson had much higher "upsides".
I don't think the Bobcats necessarily want anyone in this draft. To me one player isn't turning that team around. They need a lot of pieces. Your scenario provides that, but I just can't see them trading the #2 pick last year and the #4 pick this year for the #1 in this draft (where there are no #1's) and some mid to late first round picks. They need someone they can plug into their lineup and be a centerpiece for the future. Obviously that player is Thompson. I agree, he came on last year and averaged 11.7 and 9.4. While his FG% is low, this is a guy that would make Charlotte think long and hard about pulling the trigger on the deal.
Besides, then Cleveland could take Bennett and plug him for Thompson with the 4 pick. So it isn't as if they wouldn't be able to fill that position.
I think the Bucks should get in on this trade to help both teams
4 the Hornets.
Is the combo of Thompson and Porter/McLemore/Len better than MKG and Len/Bennett. Its really a toss up to me. If Len Porter and McLemore are gone at 4 they could go Bennett, Noel or Oladipo.
I saw Kyrie Irving a little embarrassed by Tristan Thompson last year. He got called out in several huddles and didn't look the happy about it. By the end of the season TT was the local leader in the huddle and challenged guys verbally a lot to get fired up and play better defense.
I would just stand pat and pick who I wanted at one. MKG is not a bonifide better prospect than Thompson. There both only good inside 16 feet but one is a small forward. TT improved as a defender even if not as a shot blocker.
PHX would be pissed if this happened because their best case scenario is McLemore, Len and Oladipo. If those guys are gone then PHX only has another tweener (albeit a good one) and Noel to choose from.
I still want MKG but he had a lot of injury scares last year. He started the year off when knee issues and didn't play Summer League. Then those issues came back up at times during the season. He had that concussion scare also and seemed to struggle afterward. Jeffery Taylor was also the coaches preferred defensive stopper.
I would have a hard time trading Thompson for MGK straight up, even though its a toss up. I definitely wouldn't give any other picks to loss three spots in the draft.
Cleveland doesn't need to trade with anybody. Porter fits better in cleveland anyway with his ability to spread the floor, and he'll have an extra year on his contract, and cleveland won't have to give anything up.
It's kind of funny to debate about in 2013 what deal the Cavs in Bobcats are making but in actuality this trade is pretty detrimental to both franchises. I like MKG but the Cavs may be overvaluing him a bit. I say stick with your guns, draft Len, then maybe make some moves with your other 3 picks later in the draft. I mean who seriously thinks Zeller is going to be the long term center solution? The pick makes sense so stick with it. As for Charlotte I'm pretty sure they'll be tanking it next year with or without MKG.
Only way I'm giving up MKG to the Cavs is in a package for Kyrie Irving.