I love the new mock and consider it the best one yet.
I especially like seeing FSU's Toney Douglas on the first round bubble now at #31. He's an awesome player on offense and defense. ACC leading scorer 21.5ppg. and Defensive Player of the Year. Think he'll be a great pro.
I also agree that Wayne Ellington has moved up into the late lottery. He's a long 6'5" and a pure shooter whose stroke reminds me of Reggie Miller.
I would put Ty Lawson in the lottery now between 3-7. He's looking more and more like Chris Paul everyday. Similar size, strength, speed, shooting, steals, etc.
I think Greg Monroe will go higher - mid lottery.
I think James Johnson will go higher - late lottery.
I think Sam Young will go higher - late lottery.
I think James Harden will fall into the mid first. He'll be one of those hot potatoes that all of the lottery teams are afraid to touch.
Yet No one else sees wayne going in the lottery because all he can do is shoot at the next level... he doesn't have the ball handling to score at the 2 in the nba, the best he will be is a weaker less athletic version of Courtney Lee.
IF you put Ty lawson 3-7 go have your head checked out.... No way he goes before Jennings Rubio Griffin Hasheem Harden and Monroe.
I don't like james Johnson...where was he last year? Unknown is right and he still wasn't great this year
Sam Young is a nice player but Lottery is a big push 20-40 maybe.
I disagree...Harden has to much manu in him for teams not to want to take him...It is Sneaky smooth and can score.
I think Ty Lawson will end up a player between Jameer Nelson and Chris Paul as an NBA point guard.
I think Brandon Jennings will end up the next Kenny Anderson.
To me, the top PGs are:
6'8" sophmore James Johnson was better this year than Jeff Green in his final year at Georgetown. Compare their stats for evidence.
James Harden will fall out of the lottery. He's a loser who repeatedly failed under pressure and flopped in all of his team's biggest games. Both the Pac-10 and NCAA Tournament. Check out ASU's last 3 games of the season. I can excuse one bad game. Not three in a row. Harden will be the next Alando Tucker in the NBA, but Tucker is more athletic. I rate Harden a lowly 6 in athleticism.
As someone who watched a vast majority of Alando Tucker's games in college (I'm from Madison) -- that comparison is completely unwarranted. I've seen baseless comparisons made left and right on these boards, but since this one had some relevance to me, I'm finally speaking up. Typically, I would make about fifteen-deep list of how inaccurate said comparison is....but I think it would be more entertaining to see you justify it. Nothing against you. I'm just curious.
It's not so much a player comparison, but an NBA success projection.
James Harden will be as successful in the NBA as Alando Tucker is today... and have a similar impact.
Take away their speed and athleticism, and OJ Mayo, Russell Westbrook and Eric Gordon would have all been undrafted last year, struggle in the NBA, or be career bench players.
James Harden rates about a 6 athletically. He just isn't athletic. He's slow. No first step. No leap. No lift. Not a pure shooter. Too slow to drive effectively in the NBA. Too slow to play good defense. Lack of leaping ability will negatively impact his ability to finish. Harden's below average athleticism just doesn't translate well to the NBA SG position.
Pac-10 stats mean nothing. Luke Jackson was a Pac-10 Player of the Year who averaged 21.2ppg. 7.2rpg. 4.5 apg. 48.8% fg. 86.2% ft. 44% 3-pt. fg. in college.
Why isn't Luke Jackson a huge star in the NBA?
Too slow. Too unathletic.
Same situation with James Harden at SG.
Too slow. Too unathletic.
Success in college - Yes
Success in the NBA - No
I'm trying to figure out which comparison is more laughable...comparing Hardin to Luke Jackson or Wayne Ellington to Reggie Miller.
Luke Jackson is white guy...James Harden will be good NBA player!!
About James Johnson you have right but Jeff Green is better shooter.
And in my opinion Ty Lawson will be better NBA PG than Rubio because he doesn't have NBA body and strenght
Lawson's a worse prospect than Raymond Felton so I expect his career to be similar....
And Lodzio, your nuts...Rubio is the most hyped European to ever come into the NBA...he's going to be a beast!
Maybe Rubio will be good in NBA...but i don't like european players...
- Harden is the 2nd safest pick in this draft. I think his athleticism will surprise at the pre-draft workouts, and you are looking at a player with a game that should be very similar to Brandon Roy. Anyone who has seen him play knows he will be a good NBA player.
- Lawson is a poor man's Raymond Felton.
- Rubio will be better than Lawson, despite his European-ness.
Where did you come up with your scale of athleticism? Why is 6 considered "lowly"? Is it out of 100?
How did you decide that Harden deserves just a lowly 6?
Its very interestin how 3 games make u a terrible prospect...even worse luke jackson comparisons lmao lets b serious...Harden can hoop if u think othawise u cudnt have seen him play...o n wayne ellington wont b much in the league in my eyes so draftin him b4 the 20th pick would probaly b a mistake n thats me bein nice
This guy can really shoot it. He should be one of the first two or three shooting guards taken. He reminds me of Ray Allen. He will be fantastic coming off of screens and he can take the ball to the basket. I think Ellington will be a better pro than James Harden.
I think Lawson is a notch or two below Chris Paul and Deron Williams. I would take Lawson over DJ Augustine, Raymond Felton, and probably even Jameer Nelson.
I would love to see Jameer Nelson v Ty Lawson (Nelson is a tough player) I think I would take Nelson in that match up he is one of the better point guards in the NBA....
The Luke Jackson reference wasn't a player comparison. Everyone knows that Luke Jackson plays a diifferent position SF
It was just proof that Pac-10 performance means NOTHING in the NBA if a player is too slow and too unathletic.
Luke Jackson averaged 21.2ppg. 7.2rpg. 4.5 apg. 48.8% fg. 86.2% ft. 44% 3-pt. fg. and was Pac-10 Player of the Year.
Why did Luke Jackson flop in the NBA at SF?
Same reason why James Harden will flop in the NBA at SG.
No first step.
The things Luke Jackson did in college at SF, he can't do in the NBA.
The things James Harden did in college at SG, he won't do in the NBA.
In the Pac-10 and NCAA tournaments, Harden's first step was so slow, he couldn't even drive past the opposing team's big men.
If Harden's first step is too slow to drive past college big men, how's he going to drive past NBA wing players?
You're an idiot. Stop while you are clearly behind.
1. Harden isn't an elite athlete but he's not a 300 pound whale either. You make it sound like he runs around with lead feet when if you'd watched him you'd be able to see that's wrong.
2. wtf are you talking about "can't drive past college big men"? He easily passed big men when they switched onto him on the pick and roll.
3. It's obvious what this is. You read about his tournament games and are now coming up with a conclusion that is based on nothing but the &$#%#&@! that's oozing out of your brain.
4. And your comment about taking away speed and athleticism takes the cake. You take away ANYONE'S speed and athleticism and they're a bench player. You think Wade would dominate without his quicks? You think Lebron would have ever been noticed without his athleticism?
Just stop, please. Before someone reads your retarded post, is stupid enough to believe it and we have a pair of you starting threads where you &$#%#&@! about how much James Harden sucks.
"You take away ANYONE'S speed and athleticism and they're a bench player."
That's why James Harden will be a bench player.
He doesn't have the speed or athleticism to begin with.
The fact is, his first step is too slow.
His lack of speed and athleticism were exposed in the Pac-10 and NCAA tournaments.
Too slow to get his shot off.
He couldn't drive past anybody.
He couldn't even drive past opposing big men like Taj Gibson.
How's he going to drive past NBA wings?
Harden collapsed in every big game, so he's not worth the risk in the lottery.
He didn't just fail in one big game. He failed in EVERY big game.
Too much of a gamble. Maybe mid-first round.
OH MY GOD
1. You must be slow or something. How can you not understand how retarded it was to say that taking away a player's speed and athleticism makes him a bench player?
2. His lack of physical tools wasn't exposed in the tournament you idiot. The fact his team had no one else who could score and allowed the defence to focus solely on him was what "got exposed".
3. He's already driven around college big men. I don't know any other way to explain this to you so i'm not going to waste my time trying.
4. Like I said, just stop. You have no evidence for your arguement and it's pure &$#%#&@! anyway.
You said: "You take away ANYONE'S speed and athleticism and they're a bench player."
Take away OJ Mayo's speed and athleticism and he's a bench player.
Take away Eric Gordon's speed and athleticism and he's a bench player.
Take away Russell Westbrook's speed and athleticism and he's a bench player.
James Harden doesn't have speed and athleticism to begin with, so what does that make him?
Florida State had no one else who could score, except for Toney Douglas.
Opposing defenses focused soley on Toney Douglas.
That didn't stop Toney Douglas from averaging 26ppg in the ACC and NCAA tournaments.
Wow how can you even say that about Harden? Obviously you didnt watch him play you have got to be kidding me. I guess every mock draft has him top 5 for no reason. Cuz he has no talent no first step no athleticism right? wow