[TallmanNYCParticipant]

Funny example of how +/- on court can result in some screwy numbers in an individual game. In the Spurs/Rockets overtime game, Parsons (who played 41 minutes) was somehow -27 during those minutes. And he didn’t have a terrible game scoring 20 points on 18 shots. Lin went off for 38, but I assume you already heard all about that.

Below is the boxscore that I copied into this post. I’ve got a feeling it won’t come out well.

Rockets
STARTERS MIN FG-A 3P-A FT-A REB (O/D) AST ST BLK TO PF +/- PTS
Parsons F 41 7-18 4-8 2-5 7 (2/5) 4 1 0 2 2 -27 20
Patterson FC 21 4-10 0-2 0-0 2 (1/1) 1 1 0 1 0 -9 8
Asik C 35 5-11 0-0 11-14 10 (4/6) 2 1 2 2 4 +3 21
Lin PG 42 11-21 4-5 12-12 3 (1/2) 7 2 2 2 2 -4 38
Delfino GF 38 2-12 1-5 0-1 4 (0/4) 5 3 1 3 0 +2 5
RESERVES MIN FG-A 3P-A FT-A REB (O/D) AST ST BLK TO PF +/- PTS
Douglas G 41 6-11 5-7 0-0 2 (0/2) 4 1 0 2 3 -1 17
Morris PF 25 4-6 2-3 3-4 6 (1/5) 0 3 0 2 4 +6 13
Smith C 16 2-6 0-0 0-0 6 (2/4) 0 0 3 0 4 -6 4
Cook SG 4 0-2 0-0 0-0 0 (0/0) 1 0 0 0 1 +1 0
Aldrich C 2 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 (0/0) 0 0 0 0 1 -5 0

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/nba/gameflash/2012/12/10/32240/#boxscore#ixzz2Emrdvlmo

[TRC1991Participant]

For anyone who is unsure what the +/- is, it indicates the scoring differential between the 2 teams when the player is on the court.

[SiggyParticipant]

+/- for a single game is pretty worthless.

[XYRYXParticipant]

I ihink you’re completely right but does a stat make more sense over the course of more games when it doesn’t make sense for a single game?

I always have problems with this stat line. As a Thunder fan I know that Nick Collison always is top in the league in +/- but this doesn’t mean the Thunder will be any better with him in the starting lineup even if I hink he would be as valuable as perk there with more rebounds.

I just don’t think +/- is a great stat to measure players. Maybe you can say the bench is better than the other bench but I even know this when I just look at the score.

[SiggyParticipant]

I don’t think it’s a great measure at all just by itself, but if a player is used in different situations with different personnel you can get an idea of how they impact other players or the team as a whole over a larger sample of games. Like if the player runs with both the 1st and 2nd units, you can see if they have a positive/negative impact on other players (by looking at the other teammates’ +/- when on the floor with a particular player) or if they can be as effective in different roles (+/- with different units). There are much better metrics to measure player impact than the simple +/- though.

[HitsterParticipant]

It can help to judge who is effective put players on successful teams will always be higher due to this fact so it does skew things a bit. Sometimes when a team wins a game and the starters are all minus it looks amusing and you can see how a bench has won the game.

[TallmanNYCParticipant]

Yeah and the thing that I thought was funny is that how could Parson be -27 in a game that was so close that it went to overtime and that played a huge amount of the minutes.

But yes, individual player plus minus over one game is worthless. The stat is impacted by the other 9 guys on the court. Your opponent misses a FT, that helps your plus minus. Someone on your team hits a desperation three with the shot clock winding down, you get +3 even if you had very little to do with it.

[PureshooterParticipant]

I think it’s a worthless stat. For instance, if the normal substitution routine is to take out two all-star starters and bring in a sixth man of the year and a scrub, the sixth man of the year might have a negative +/- over an entire season because of the liability of the other bench player.

[SiggyParticipant]

Not true since good 6th men spend a lot of time with the first unit and they close games as well. Plus they would also be going against a lot of bench players.

[Author]

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