[OhCanada-Participant]

 What do you guys think about Collins? Is he higher than Leaf, Rabb, Adebayo?

 Seems to be drawing interest in the mid 1st round.I watched him play a few games. He gets great post position, has amazing touch and footwork, and is a quick and explosive leaper. Didnt use his jumpshot alot at Wake Forest but has a good midrange jumper and has been shooting well in workouts,Good basketball iq and if Im not mistaken posted the best PER in the nation while going 19pppg and 10rpg in the toughest conference ACC. Not too strong but is physical and crafty.Kind of an oldschool PF. His game is more built to play Center nowadays yet he is under 6’10 just 225 with a 6’11 wingspan. Averaged only 0.5 apg last year and didnt shoot three pointers.

I keep hearing that Miami (14), Portland (15), and Atlanta (19) are all very interested. Portlland picks again at 20 and 26 and Atlanta picks again at 31 so they may not pick him so early in less they fell in love with him during workouts/interviews. I had/have TJ Leaf ahead of him but it seems teams are concerned with his defensive liabilities. Collins is one of the reasons my mock is incomplete. I dont whether I should put him at 14 or 31 which is a large discrepency.

 

 

 

[kobyzParticipant]

 i see Detroit at 12 also in play for him…

[Evan_MilbergParticipant]

He’s definitely higher than Rabb and Adebayo. Not sure about Leaf. I have Collins going 12 to Detroit, but I could see a scenario where he slips to Miami at 14 or Portland at 15. I don’t see him falling to the 20s unless something like an injury happens to him right before draft night. 

 

[sweaterflexParticipant]

Collins projects as a Tristan Thompson-type on defense who can switch screens and rebound and rim run on offense like Clint Capela. I don’t see him as a 4 at the next level, but I doubt Rabb or Adebayo play the 4 either. His wingspan prevents him from being an above average rim defender, he would fit best with another player who can defend the rim from the weak side. I don’t see him falling past Portland at #20 (fits nicely as an Ed Davis substitute) with his ceiling at Detroit at #12 (Pistons seem frustrated by Drummond’s lack of development and poor foul shooting).

[Robb_CParticipant]

 John Collins was extremely efficient on the College Level,  I like his game a lot and think he will take some time to handle the physical side of the league.. Hes very good in transition and has a great feel for the game would be a very nice fit in Denver next to Jokic.. 

My opinion TJ Leaf is the best PF would not be surprised if a team takes him inside the top 10, He literally is the most gifted offensive four in this draft, and has the potential to be a pretty decent defender.

 

 

 

[Robb_CParticipant]

If TJ Leafs name was TJ Leafavich he’d be a top 5 pick.. Hes better than Dragan Bender.

[nill650Participant]

 Highly efficient small ball center in college, doesn’t translate with subpar length . But is solid athlete and has some good footwork. the only thing keeping him out of lottery is his innability to stretch the floor,becasue aside from that his rebounding was stellar.

he shot 1 three in his 2 yrs of college …1 and missed badley.

If some team needs a smallball center they will likely look at him but there are plenty of pf/c in the 14-30 range with same or better athleticism and length ,so it will come down to fit and the teams confidance that he improve as a passer,which he is not very good at. 

I see him as a t-robb type without the length and have him going early 2nd if Indy at 18 and Portland at 26 look elsewhere

 

[benny15Participant]

 .net members love their player comparisons and mine for john collins is that of a young david lee. good fundamental offensive player who can score well in the block and has a decent mid range shot he can take with regularity when left open. plus rebounder who can get double digits in a game so long as he gets starter minutes. 

i dont think its a concern wheather he will be a contributer in the next level, but more if his game doesnt fit in todays age of pace and space. i believe this is the reason why his projections is all over the place from late lotto, to mid first to early second. i feel any team in the league could always use a productive player on the court, either in limitted minutes or in stretches. 

 

[Dell87Participant]

 No disrespect but I would never draft a white center that high ever. They have a terrible track record. Name one white center that has become a great player over the last 10-15 years.  There are only a handful of good white players(American born) players in this league period . 

Great 

Griffin ( he’s half white . So does that count? Lol) 

Heyward( is he great or really good?)

Kevin love (same as heyward)

Good

Ryan Anderson 

Chandler Parsons 

Cody Zeller

Tyler Johnson 

McConnell

JJ redick 

Kaminsky 

Korver

Serviceable 

Every other white guy in the league lol

My point being . Drafting an American born white player almost never translates to them being an all star. A few of them become decent role players . Now I know the same can be said for American born black players too. But there’s no way I’m wasting a pick on Collins. They all look great in college but it almost never carries over to the NBA. 

Sorry just stating facts 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[llperez]

I agree, that’s why I wouldn’t waste a first rounder on Ike anigbogu either, too white for my liking.

[Dell87Participant]

 Odds are he`ll pan out before collins does .

[Dell87Participant]

 Sorry got him confused with Zach collins. Same argument applies though lol 

 

[OhCanada-Participant]

 White Americans go straight to Larry Bird when this discussion gets brought up. 

[nill650Participant]

 first off that is racist, 2nd off you don’t even know the names of the prospects in the draft.

John Collins of Wake Forest is the subject of this thread.

Not Zack Collins of Gonzaga who is ranked higher than John Collins by every national media outlet in the world, and more importantly by every GM in the nba.

I guess you are smarter then they are.

your rational about nationality skin color or descent are pathetic at best. 

trying to make an argument that intl white players are better nba players than USA born white players is like trying to argue that since you have more nickels than dimes , the dimes are worth less.

 

[Dell87Participant]

 American born white players don’t become stars . Its just a fact . And don’t try to bring up the argument of oh well black players don’t become great at tennis or golf. The fact is more white people play college basketball  more than black people play tennis and golf by far. And if more black guys played hockey tennis lacrosse and golf. Then I guarantee you would see more black athletes dominating those sports too. I would love more than anyone to see another Larry bird or Kevin McHale or Pete maravich, especially when you see how dominant some white guys are in college . But sadly it almost never translates to the NBA. 

[nill650Participant]

 so your point is? all I am gathering from your comments is how fos you are.

if you think that because 90% previously drafted individuals in the modern erz of the nba that were of one race or nationality have not become stars in the league that means you can use racial profiling to determine if a player won’t become a star in the league…it’s just uneducated garbage too think that way.  I guess you would use the golf analogy on a golf forum arguing that vj singh will never make it in the pga because noone else of his race or nationality has? same dumb argument same wrong result.

 

[Dell87Participant]

 Facts is facts dude.  Dont be mad because I’m right. American born white players don’t become all stars. If any of these ones in this draft become a future allstar , Ill be singing his praises. But I wouldnt count on it. And I guarantee you they’re won’t be an American born white player go first overall no time soon. 

[llperez]

 2 american born white guys(love/hayward) made all-star team all the way back in february. Not to mention both curry and klay are half white.

besides, youre really moving the goal posts around. Nobody is talking about zach collins going #1(not that this thread was even about zach to begin with) so why are you all up in arms? There are in fact numerous quality white guys who are contributing and worthy of having been drafted in the top 10-20. 

 

[Dell87Participant]

 And both of them are not centers . My point proven. People always wanna say klay and steph is half white when it helps their arguments smh. 

[llperez]

well if we are narrowing it to centers, then how many centers period have become stars? The position is not what it used to be in terms of having go to guys and running your offense through the post. I mean basically role players who do the basics (pachulia/thompson) are starting in the nba finals. If you go back to this past all-star game, there were only 3 centers between both confeences combined(deandre, gasol, cousins). And deandre is a role player on steroids, not a guy you want having the ball.

 

  

[Dell87Participant]

 Your right. But my feelings will never change until I see the trend change. I am not drafting an American born white center with my lottery pick. Ever. Late first round/ second round , possibly. I’ll play the percentages.

[llperez]

if you have this “i wouldnt draft someone who is white because white guys dont pan out” opinion, then you are not very smart. You have to weigh each prospect as an individual. And being a bust is all about where you are drafted. How many white guys have been drafted in top 5 that didnt pan out over last decade? If you get drafted around #10, like zach collins is projected, he doesnt need to become all-nba caliber to be a good pick.

[Dell87Participant]

 Thats true. If he becomes serviceable then that’s not bad. But with a top ten pick, I want more than serviceable. Thats just me

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